Castle Paradox

[Me]

I prefer turn-based as well, but the OHR is perfectly fine for my tastes. If you set the "wait on spell menus" bitset on and have a wait time before each attack depending on how long it takes to get it ready (a la Timestream Saga), you'll get a system similar to the one Sephyroth mentioned.
But a strictly turn-based option would be nice, that is true.
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[Flamer]

turn-based, it allows more strategy and is more free with what moves you are going to use...
i didn't know ATB was copyrighted by square... oh well, not that it matters...
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If we were a pack of dogs, IM would be a grand Hound, CN would be a very ficious little pitball, and Giz...well, it doesn't matter breed he is, he'd still be a bitch
(no offense to anyone that was mentioned)

[Eggie]

These are the pros and cons of both ATB and Turn Based. In ATB you need to move a people, not a team. What I mean is, you could attack four times (considering you have huge speed) before someone else, while of TB, you can strategize your turns, and hope you go before your enemy. Perfect examples of ATB is most of OHR games, and perfect examples of TB is Dragon Warrior. I would like to see TB in OHR if possible, though.

RPGRealms- You are right. Screw realism. When I introduced the idea of having speed premanately 10, people thought it was unrealistic to run everywhere you go. Of course I responded by saying “I do not want to wait for me to walk so slowly.”

[Uncommon]

I'm sort of using a "Wait" ATB, which is a slight combination of both systems, as each turn is based on how fast a person is, but the whole process stops when someone's turn comes up.

I know that my little brother prefers an "Active" ATB, as he enjoys the fast pace of the battles. I myself like it somewhere in between.

[no_shot]

Isn't there an option in the OHR that makes the battle pause on menus?
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[Uncommon]

Yeah, it does, but mine is a custom battle system.

[Pepsi Ranger]

Believe it or not I'm no human glossary when it comes to RPG related terms and such, but I do have a little point of interest to add as far as what I prefer goes.

I've actually been thinking a bit about this subject ever since my game finally got reviewed and was constructively criticized for its boring battle system (the OHR default of course). So I've been thinking of ways that I can better present battles, which in effect means creating a new battle system.

Even though I'm not sure what my skills will produce, my vision is to update the present system into something a little more interactive and visually stimulating. But the question I've been wondering about is whether or not to keep the ATB speed issue intact, or to go turn-based (which I think would be a bit easier and more convenient to script).

I personally prefer the turn-based system, but I can see where the active system adds more "action" to the story line. But then something about this thread reminded me of something.

One of my favorite RPGs to date is a game called Jagged Alliance 2. For starters, the game is so incredibly huge with so many clever gameplay elements that strategy is only Stage 1 of the several different levels of gameplay this adventure offers. It is also the game that turned me on to the turn-based system to begin with.

This is how the game handles it:

Each turn is given to a team, not an individual. The player's turn (as the mercs) is not over until he or she clicks the check mark button. The player is permitted to accomplish as much as possible before hitting that "end turn button." Once all the moves have been made and the check has been clicked, the computer will first allow the enemies to make their moves, and then civilians (if any are present) will make their moves. Then it goes back to the player.

Here's where speed comes into play. The turn-based system allows for plenty of time to plan a strategy, but every move hinges on a set number of action points. This means that a character can do as much as he possibly can until his action points run out. For example, if the character has 20 action points available, then he or she can run as far as the action points will let him (usually 2 points per step). If he's engaged in battle, he can fire off as many shots as the action points will allow. The action points required are determined on stance, position, weapon, and overall whatever real life would simulate. So in a sense, the turn-based system is still timed, even though there's no need for the player to rush.

But that's not all. Action points are affected by several various conditions. For example, if a character gets shot, his action points will be seriously reduced (often bringing him down to 10 points for the next turn). Likewise, if he just got through sprinting from one backyard to the next, his energy will drop, which means his action points will be a few points lower than the last turn. However, letting him rest for a turn will replenish him back to his normal speed--or in the case of getting shot, rest will bring him up a couple points even though his affected health will prevent him from returning to optimal speed. The game is also set up to work on a day and night system, which means that mercs can get tired if the player doesn't let them sleep after many hours of traveling. A fatigued merc is about as slow as a critically injured merc, which means the action points available will be low.

And that's the basic gist of how this particular game's turn-based system works. I suppose most turn-based games allow entire teams to go before the next team goes, but this game in particular makes room for status conditions to affect how much can be done per turn, which I think adds to the strategy and challenge.
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Progress Report:

The Adventures of Powerstick Man: Extended Edition

Currently Updating: General sweep of the game world and dialogue boxes. Adding extended maps.

Tightfloss Maiden

Currently Updating: Chapter 2

[Me]

I oncw actaully created a battle system (well, a manipulation of stats using the OHR's built in engine) that attempted to emulate the speed and chaos of a shootout. By setting everyone's speed to around 200 and rasing Dodge to godlike levels, I hoped to make a system where getting hit once would be either severely damaging or outright deadly, but where misses occurred often. The massive speed increase was due to the fact that, realistically, if you have a gun, you aren't going to wait ten to twently seconds between each shot. The end result was a failure, as the battles devolved into endless button-mashing, and strategy was thrown out in favor of a little thing I like to call "total blind luck."
However, I'm currently trying to refine this system, as I would like to have something that plays like a real battle, not a strategic missile exchange.
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[Flamer]

heh, 200 speed... that's insane.
i remember seeing a game that fast, all i did was hope and hold the spacebar down.

that battle system pepsi ranger mentioned sounds complex and fun to play around in. too bad it sounds like a headache to continuously play with though.
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If we were a pack of dogs, IM would be a grand Hound, CN would be a very ficious little pitball, and Giz...well, it doesn't matter breed he is, he'd still be a bitch
(no offense to anyone that was mentioned)

[msw188]

Pepsi Ranger's post about the action-points turn-based system seemed pretty interesting, although it almost seems like it becomes too complicated in the end to be truly fun. I totally agree with some things said earlier (and I've said them too): realism is not worth the reduction in fun. Moreover, I see no reason why out of two games that are basically equal otherwise, the one that is more realistic is usually regarded as better. Now when I say realistic, I mean that aspects of the game mimic what would really occur in real life. However, I do prefer a certain consistency within the world of the game.
Anyway, that's not the topic here. I noticed another thing about Pepsi Ranger's post, and a couple others, which I'm afraid may be a misunderstanding. When I say a turn-based battle system, I mean a system like Dragon Warrior where both 'teams' give their commands, and then their speed stats determine who does what first in a 'round' of battle. I do NOT mean that one team has a turn, where all of their actions are taken, and then another team gets their turn (that sounds more like role-playing board games and card games). I don't really like the idea of a whole team getting their turn, followed by another team getting their turn; that certainly eliminates speed from the game, and reduces need for foresight as you know that your team's actions will occur immediately, without possible interference by the enemy.

[Eggie]

Actually, I would have to say the ultimate turn system would have to be the Fallout Tactics turn system. Of course, the Action Point system should be improved, but that basic idea is pretty sweet. I liked how you could hide around stuff, walk around, go up to people and take them down by using a Colt Magnum, and take off a rib or two. That system induces lots of strategy, far more than any ATB or REGULAR Turn based system.

[Pepsi Ranger]

Actually, Eggie, that's sort of how Jagged Alliance's system works. An older game series that did this well was the X-Com series. Hiding behind boxes, rocks, trees, buildings, lying under windows, closing doors in front of you before your enemy can fire a shot--all those are featured here.

And one thing I forgot to mention in the last post but meant to initially was that there is also a system called "Interrupt" which allows a character to get a free turn when an enemy runs into line of sight (which can or cannot be taken depending on how many action points were left over from the last turn). That turn is only given to the character(s) who spot the enemy running into their lines of sight. And this system is given to both parties, not just the good guys.

Flamer, the system is actually very fun. As I said this game is one of my favorites and it's not just because of the story line. The only headache you'll get is knowing that it'll take several hundred hours to finish if you're a beginner and trying to find everything.

In case any of you want to check it out, it's on the PC and requires a Pentium 2 at something like 233 MegaHerz (133 minimum). Last I checked it now comes with the Unfinished Business expansion pack for only $20. I know that in February it'll be coming out with yet a new expansion pack called Wildfire (also for $20) that will package the original game.

It is rated "M" so all you kids under seventeen should probably skip it, but for the rest of you, it'll give you some great ideas.

Trust me, it's worth it. The battle system is more fun than just about anything you'll play on the OHR or in Final Fantasy. My opinion anyway.

And yes, this is different than what msw188 is saying, but it works. The only time it gets frustrating is when you get further in the game and have to deal with many enemies, many citizens, and a full militia (which you have the option to train after you liberate a town) to take their turns before getting your next turn. But it's a minor setback for something so clever.
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Progress Report:

The Adventures of Powerstick Man: Extended Edition

Currently Updating: General sweep of the game world and dialogue boxes. Adding extended maps.

Tightfloss Maiden

Currently Updating: Chapter 2

[TMC]

Unlike almost everyone else here (I was quite shocked at that), I prefer ATB systems. CANT STAND turn based combat, except in some cases. What's wrong with ATB? If its too fast to think, turn wait on menus on. Personally I normally I play with active menus, as it makes it a bit more tense. And I don't click on the first thing that comes under my finger.

Actually, I played a game with a battle system like the one PR has described, and though Jagged Alliance sounds like a good game, the game I played gave me my very dislike of turn based battle systems. 3 minutes of clicking on units and then clicking on squares, aiming all weapons, giving the computer time to think, for 12 seconds of actual action? :S
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