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Weapons, personalities, and what if there weren't swords?
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PlayerOne




Joined: 07 Sep 2005
Posts: 143
Location: UK

PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2007 8:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I seem to remember that about 90% of the magic weapons found in D&D were long swords. It really didn't pay to specialise in something out-of-the-ordinary.

JRPGs tend to give each character a different weapon, and it doesn't really matter too much what it is. Every shop seems to have a slightly better version of each.

There is something cool about a sword, though, which means it is often the weapon of the lead character. And there are plenty of different styles of sword to explore.
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Newbie_Power




Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 1762

PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2007 8:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fire Emblem 9 has a Bolt Axe and Flame Lance to accompany the Wind Sword, but both the Bolt Axe and Flame Lance are useless because there isn't a character whose Magic is high enough to output more damage than a physical attack, and the Wind Sword is more suited for a character that uses swords and uses magic staves at the same time.

I think Fire Emblem 4 has the Bolt Axe and Flame Lance, but I never really used the Flame Lance and the Bolt Axe is a legendary weapon that's enemy only.
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J.A.R.S.
In umbram deo, ex nihilo...




Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 451
Location: Under the rainbow...

PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2007 3:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

playerone: Btw I've never been fond of games where you keep on buying better swords because A - it feels unnatural and synthetic in so many fields and B - it feels like it would be such a more interesting discovery to get from a dungeon or enemy (aka Zelda a link to the past where you don't buy swords at all)
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Newbie_Power




Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 1762

PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2007 3:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
playerone: Btw I've never been fond of games where you keep on buying better swords because A - it feels unnatural and synthetic in so many fields and B - it feels like it would be such a more interesting discovery to get from a dungeon or enemy (aka Zelda a link to the past where you don't buy swords at all)

Uh...

A lot of good RPGs I have played put the generic swords in the shops, and spread around the best weapons in places where you have to work to get them. You have to Rock into Mordor to get Ultima Weapon, while you get to buy Rapiers and Dirks in a flea market.

And I don't care what anyone says: Zelda does not follow a traditional RPG formula, whether it is an RPG or not. I'm not even going to debate this. The reason you can buy weapons and armor is because you have a party to manage, and not every one of them gets to have special equipment until the end of the game, meaning that you have to manage wisely and choose the best equipment that accompanies each character's skill.
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Camdog




Joined: 08 Aug 2003
Posts: 606

PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 8:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Newbie_Power wrote:
A lot of good RPGs I have played put the generic swords in the shops, and spread around the best weapons in places where you have to work to get them. You have to Rock into Mordor to get Ultima Weapon, while you get to buy Rapiers and Dirks in a flea market.


True, but I agree with playerone. It always struck me as odd that my "Gold Sword" was doing so much more damage than my steel sword was. But, I suppose like any game, some realism needs to be sacrificed for the sake of the gameplay mechanaic. It would be nice if a more elegant way of doing this could be found though.
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Newbie_Power




Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 1762

PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm talking about weapons with special properties that you just won't find in shops. Even if a sword you find doesn't do more damage, it might have a special ability such as casting Protect if you use it as an item, or inflicts a useful status effect.

And I didn't know what you meant by Gold Sword until I remembered Zelda: AttLP. Stop talking about Zelda, because 1. That Golden Sword is an upgrade of the Master Sword from a magical fairy, and 2. I am talking about RPGs such as Final Fantasy, Dragon Warrior IV, or OHRRPGCE games.
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J.A.R.S.
In umbram deo, ex nihilo...




Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 451
Location: Under the rainbow...

PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 10:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Since it seems there is a debate to be had...
It is just so not epic to buy a broad sword from a shop. I tend to favor Chrono's way around weaponry. RARELY shall you truly buy your weapon from a shop. More than half of the time, you'll get it from a dungeon, and on four different occurences, you'll still get the option to get a all purpose OR narrow purpose weapon (Red katana, Robot's two last arms, frog's two magical blades)
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Newbie_Power




Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 1762

PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 11:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
It is just so not epic to buy a broad sword from a shop.
Does it even need to be epic? Does going shopping ruin the adventure so much that you will stop playing the game?
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J.A.R.S.
In umbram deo, ex nihilo...




Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 451
Location: Under the rainbow...

PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 11:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

it did delay me 2 years before finishing lufia II XD but I think I was more angry at the whole "buying spells" thing although significantly more logical when I come to think of it...
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Newbie_Power




Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 1762

PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 11:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
but I think I was more angry at the whole "buying spells" thing although significantly more logical when I come to think of it...
Buying spells tends to eat more money than buying weapons. Solution: Have characters learn spells instead, because they can't learn weapons.
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TwinHamster
♫ Furious souls, burn eternally! ♫




Joined: 07 Mar 2004
Posts: 1352

PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 11:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
And I didn't know what you meant by Gold Sword until I remembered Zelda: AttLP. Stop talking about Zelda, because 1. That Golden Sword is an upgrade of the Master Sword from a magical fairy, and 2. I am talking about RPGs such as Final Fantasy, Dragon Warrior IV, or OHRRPGCE games.

I think Camdog was referring to the generic sword level of Wooden<Copper<Bronze<Steel<Silver<Gold. Where a weapon's strength is derived from its value instead of its realistic properties.
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Newbie_Power




Joined: 04 Sep 2006
Posts: 1762

PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If that is the case, then Gold Swords automatically fail no matter what method of storing weapons in dungeons you use.
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Camdog




Joined: 08 Aug 2003
Posts: 606

PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 11:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TwinHamster wrote:
I think Camdog was referring to the generic sword level of Wooden<Copper<Bronze<Steel<Silver<Gold. Where a weapon's strength is derived from its value instead of its realistic properties.


Yup.

NewbiePower wrote:
If that is the case, then Gold Swords automatically fail no matter what method of storing weapons in dungeons you use.


What are you talking about? What does this have to do with my point? Substitute any metal for gold, if it makes you happy.
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J.A.R.S.
In umbram deo, ex nihilo...




Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 451
Location: Under the rainbow...

PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 12:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gold is cheap when it comes to make swords, but some rpgs seem to solve the problem by associating gold with magic sources... the damages is partly explained by the fact the weapon is magically imbued... otherwise, there is indeed no reason why a golden sword would deal more damage than an iron sword, in fact, iron swords are more resistant than copper or golden sword, but can hardly say they do more damages too (unless you specify its from the acute sharpening of the blade). But i think if we stick to these rules, we're breaking the whole idea behind progressive weaponry, ...
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Moogle1
Scourge of the Seas
Halloween 2006 Creativity Winner
Halloween 2006 Creativity Winner



Joined: 15 Jul 2004
Posts: 3377
Location: Seattle, WA

PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2007 1:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TwinHamster wrote:
I think Camdog was referring to the generic sword level of Wooden<Copper<Bronze<Steel<Silver<Gold. Where a weapon's strength is derived from its value instead of its realistic properties.


I enjoyed the Golden Swords in FF3, which are useless by the time you get to them but they have a high sell value. This was an amusing reversal.
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